Sally Conor (SC): Let’s start by talking about where you’re from.

Kahurangi Eruera (KE): I grew up with my mother’s side of the family in Whangārei, in the Taitokerau (Northland) area. Her connections on her father’s side stretch to the Hokianga, to Mangakahia also, which is on the way to Kaikohe, north of Whangārei. I love Northland. It’s my stronghold, I suppose, where I feel at home. I did all my schooling there and I was schooled in total immersion te reo Māori until I was 11, so that was the basis for my learning. It framed my worldview, my outlook on life. My dad is also from Te Tairāwhiti, the eastern East Cape – right at the tip of the East Cape and then further down nearer Napier and Hawke’s Bay.

SC: What made you decide to pursue architecture?

KE: I think originally it was a creative pursuit. I grew up always wanting to make and design stuff so I thought I was going to be a builder or a fashion designer because I liked drawing. When I got to high school, it was art, design and graphics. 

I was really into Māori art at the time and was trying to move a lot of those influences into architecture. I didn’t really see that a lot growing up. Then, when I got to university, I started understanding more about how architecture can influence people and enable communities, particularly Māori communities, by seeing themselves within architecture.

SC: And what led you to apply for He Maunga He Tangata?

KE: There were a few things. One was Phil Wihongi – Māori Design Lead in the Urban Design Unit at Te Kaunihera o Tāmaki Makaurau. He told me about the initiative. But it was really the experience you get to have within the internship and the scholarship, getting exposure in different creative environments – at Auckland Council, at a practice and at Unitec.

Also, I had always wanted to go back and complete my master’s. One of the reasons why I took a gap between my undergraduate and master’s was I wanted to reaffirm what I wanted to conduct in terms of a research project. I think a few years in practice has brought that to life. And many of the experiences I’ve had during this internship have informed my thinking too, which has been great. Building those relationships has been really key for me. It’s about meeting people and having a good rapport with people in the industry and being able to listen and take on board what they were trying to teach me.

SC: What does your research project look like at this early stage?

KE: I’m hoping to conduct a participatory design process. I thought I’d get in at the deep end. I feel like you get the best outcomes when you go to the coal face and talk to the experts, who are generally the users right? If it’s a school, which I’ve worked on a couple of, you go and talk to the teachers, you talk to the kids, and ask: ‘What do you like about your school? What do you think we should do?’ My research will be based in Whangārei where I grew up, looking at the urban outlook, the intersection of urban design and architecture because I feel like it’s quite stagnant. It definitely was when I grew up. It has changed quite a lot in the past five years but I want to try and advocate more for Te Ao Māori thinking and understanding in those spaces, to reflect the cultural significance of different areas within the city and to get mana whenua, hapū and iwi along to contribute to that process.

SC: That sounds exciting. You hear a lot about co-design and what a good consultation process looks like in architecture at the moment but do you get a sense that some of it can be tokenistic?

KE: Yeah, it’s very tricky. I feel people in architecture generally understand why you want to get iwi and others involved. They know that it’s a good thing to do. However, often there’s just not enough time allocated to a project, or there’s not enough scope, so we either can’t include it in our project or will, by necessity, end up condensing this process. That’s when a process can sometimes become a bit tokenistic or doesn’t end up reflecting what you had intended it to.

SC: Can you talk us through your experiences as the He Maunga He Tangata intern this year?

KE: I was at Auckland Council for about six weeks at the beginning of the year until I started studying at Unitec in March. This is a fresh fourth year at Unitec, so I didn’t really know anyone and had to meet people. That was quite a different experience, going back to uni, so I had to learn how to be a student again after working for a couple of years.

I spent some time at Isthmus, just under four weeks, in the mid-year period. The project work done with the council along with my work experience with Isthmus informed a lot of my co-design thinking, because they’re really, really good at it.

SC: Did you work on any specific projects while you were there?

KE: I did some work with landscape architect Alan Titchener, who partners with Isthmus sometimes, on our Sale Street Project. He was also doing some work with them on Te Waihou, near Putāruru. The iwi there wanted to create a new boardwalk, a better one. They also had a few projects in the Connected Communities scheme in Auckland, which co-designs a bunch of things in different suburbs to holistically connect all of them. They want to make it safer for all communities to use the roads because they are pretty busy transport nodes.

They’re also doing a big-block masterplan in Waikowhai, South Mount Roskill. They’re designing a new community hub, which won’t be built for another five years, so they needed a temporary hub to be built inside a house, which was quite interesting.

SC: How about when you were at council? What was that experience like?

KE: It was different. It’s interesting to know how they work compared to private practices. There are more considerations that you have to take into account. Things take longer sometimes because there are these different hoops to jump through. Even the Sale Street Project, which was my main body of work, had a few restrictions. For example, accessibility was a big consideration, which is great because it needs to be accessible to everyone but then the budgets can be quite tight. We had to understand maintenance, presuming this would be an actively used space, people’s mannerisms, throwing rubbish and those different elements. 

I think it makes sense since we are working in the public domain, with publicly funded projects for our communities but I think we all understand as architects and designers that it’s incredibly difficult to please everyone. Often a design process needs to be followed by a pilot just to prove that it actually works and that people are going to use that thing. Even this one is supposed to be temporary – it’s only supposed to be there for about five years – and then they’ll think of another, more long-term solution. But they might not. They might end up staying there for about 10 years. Who knows by that time? 

SC: What have been the challenges that you’ve come across this year, as well as the highlights?

KE: I think lockdown, especially being away from family. The rest of my family have been relatively free to do stuff outside of Auckland, they’ve been having family occasions, which I’ve missed and haven’t been part of, so those types of dynamics have been hard at times. The other one was the adjustment to university life again and creating my own regimen in terms of work and study.

There have been a fair few highlights. Our Sale Street project is one of them. It’s actually the first thing I’ve designed that I will see completed. Being a part of two school projects at Jasmax, which are currently being built. There was one site visit we went to, I think about three or four months ago, and there must’ve been about 20 kids there. They had their cute little hard hats and high-vis vests. We had them on site and they were all like, ‘This is going to be our new hall’, which was great. That’s been quite a highlight for me.

In terms of uni, it was great to understand how much support there is. Being back and doing my masters at Unitec this year, I thought, wow, there’s actually quite a lot here for people, especially Māori and Pasifika students. Those support systems were, and still are, really good for me.

SC: Next, you’ll be with TOA Architects. Do you have any sense of what you’ll be working on there?

KE: There’s one project called The Seed Bank. I think it’s what it sounds like, a storage facility for seeds. The clients want to create a concept that is conducted through a Te Ao Māori lens. They’re really thinking about the narrative of how a seed is created, how it’s planted and then how it flourishes and grows into a plant, a tree and the life cycle within that, and carrying that into the design process. It sounds pretty interesting.

SC: How about after that? What’s coming up in 2022?

KE: Next year I’ll be back with the council. One thing they’re trying to create for the Māori Design Hub is a co-designed framework that outlines what good practice looks and feels like. They’re also looking at an initiative to help embed te reo Māori into the design of Auckland. Whether it’s built, seen or heard, how can we enable people to learn, even just subconsciously as they’re walking to work, and normalise it every day?

SC: How about your aspirations for the future after graduation and beyond?

KE: It depends on how this research next year goes but I would definitely like to work in the co-design space and on collaborative projects. My purpose for next year is to create a framework and a methodology to enable and advocate for hapū and mana whenua aspirations, because sometimes they have bad experiences with practices or with local bodies within projects, and it leaves a bad taste in their mouth. So something that empowers them and allows their voices to heard and validated.

SC: What advice would you have for young people who are thinking about following a similar path into the world of architecture and design?

KE: I would say, do it. I know it’s not as simple as saying that, especially when you’re Māori and Pasifika growing up. You don’t see a lot of others in this space so I think empowering others has always been a big thing for me, especially using platforms such as this. When I was doing my undergraduate, there were about four of us (Māori students). This was a class of 100, so that’s 4%.  This year, doing fourth-year Master’s, there were three of us out of about 35–40. I think I saw a statistic last year that the number of Māori graduates coming out of university is actually declining. It’s been on a steady decline since 2010, and I thought, how? 

Especially because the work is actually turning the other way. There’s more promotion, there are more opportunities now, so hopefully, through example or through visibility, we can start actually understanding that culture does have a place, especially within design and architecture. You can use your various different backgrounds. This goes for anyone. You can bring yourself into architecture and there is a place for it. I think one of the big things is finding environments and people that foster that.

Jasmax is one of those. Phil Wihongi is definitely one of those for me, in terms of a mentor. At the University of Victoria and at Unitec, there have been various people that have been instrumental in helping me into this space. Also, my whānau has been incredibly supportive and significant in my being able to pursue architecture. I think, if you want to, it’s achievable, but look for those people that will help you get to those spaces because they are there to help.

SC: Is there anything you want to say about how to make a workplace a safe environment for a young Māori architect? 

KE: There are many things and most are very subtle. One is realising your unconscious bias, or whatever it’s called. I think people don’t actually realise the implications of it. When I was studying my undergrad, people would often say things like, ‘all Māori get scholarships.’ I’m like, ‘Well, I never got a scholarship to be here.’ Things like that. It’s quite discouraging.

Another big one is that, if you have Māori co-workers, take time to understand where those people are coming from. Sometimes Māori, especially in architecture, didn’t really grow up with a Māori upbringing, or their knowledge of te reo Māori is somewhat limited, and then they’re called on to do a karakia or to conduct formalities.

 You put them in a precarious position when you do that because some probably really want to do it and may feel the weight of that responsibility, but their knowledge and understanding may not be at a level that is appropriate and/or may not be in environments that are conducive to cultural safety.

Often, when someone is asking me to do a karakia, they will think they’re doing the right thing. But it’s about the detail. You need to know exactly what you’re asking of this person, based on where they are at this current point in time.

SC: Thank you for your time Kahurangi.

KE: Thank you to Isthmus, TOA and Unitec because they have definitely been instrumental in enabling this initiative to be created; especially Unitec for encouraging more Māori into study and architecture.

Offered jointly by Isthmus Group, Te Whare Wānanga o Wairaka Unitec Institute of Technology, and Te Kaunihera o Tāmaki Makaurau Auckland Council, the 24-month internship provides the opportunity to undertake post-graduate built environment design study, to be placed within a unique busy local government design environment, and also to be part of the design team in one of Aotearoa’s leading design studios.

Kahurangi is the second recipient of the He Maunga, He Tangata Māori design internship. The inaugural recipient was Ahlia-Mei Ta’ala, who completed her Master’s of Landscape Architecture earlier this year.